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> 418 - The Kindred (Part One)
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Revan
post Mar 4th 2008, 8:00 PM
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QUOTE(Wisdonplusone @ Mar 4th 2008, 7:47 PM) *

bow.gif Ouch got fingers burned on that last blog...Fraternal twins - of course Tayla could have twins one of which would have wraith characteristics and one without - two eggs, different genetic material being passed on. How else could there be boy/girl sets of twins? Anyway they didn't go in that direction.

Todd - I like him for an alliance - wait, hear me out - How many times have our "friends" sold us out? How many times have we been betrayed? No, I don't believe the enemy of my enemy is my friend, they are just someone else we can't trust. A betrayer of one can/will betray again. I believe we can always rely on Todd to do what is in his best interest so we know what to expect and can preempt him as we have done before. With a "friend" you never know and would trust them, possibly at the wrong time. Todd has come through for us with good intelligence so I have more faith in him then some others we have run across.

Missed where Dr. Keller has been there since day one and was promoted from within, my point was that Dr. Beckett can't return as then there would be two Chief Medical Officers.

Michael could not change his genetic material (didn't know he was altered in the beginning) until he started to revert back to a wraith and Dr Beckett's drug should have stopped working. As for changing genetics by force of will - not likely - sooo how about when he returned to the hive the bug boys tried to enhance the human stuff out of curosity and now we have ultra-Michael. Now if he mated with a "regular" wraith would his enhanced characteristics be passed on? Or would he have to create an ultra-wraith-mate? wink.gif
bow.gif Ouch got fingers burned on that last blog...Fraternal twins - of course Tayla could have twins one of which would have wraith characteristics and one without - two eggs, different genetic material being passed on. How else could there be boy/girl sets of twins? Anyway they didn't go in that direction.

Todd - I like him for an alliance - wait, hear me out - How many times have our "friends" sold us out? How many times have we been betrayed? No, I don't believe the enemy of my enemy is my friend, they are just someone else we can't trust. A betrayer of one can/will betray again. I believe we can always rely on Todd to do what is in his best interest so we know what to expect and can preempt him as we have done before. With a "friend" you never know and would trust them, possibly at the wrong time. Todd has come through for us with good intelligence so I have more faith in him then some others we have run across.

Missed where Dr. Keller has been there since day one and was promoted from within, my point was that Dr. Beckett can't return as then there would be two Chief Medical Officers.

Michael could not change his genetic material (didn't know he was altered in the beginning) until he started to revert back to a wraith and Dr Beckett's drug should have stopped working. As for changing genetics by force of will - not likely - sooo how about when he returned to the hive the bug boys tried to enhance the human stuff out of curosity and now we have ultra-Michael. Now if he mated with a "regular" wraith would his enhanced characteristics be passed on? Or would he have to create an ultra-wraith-mate? wink.gif

It is still dizygotic, technically. Fraternal is a somewhat antiquated term. Go here to learn about twins.

Unless Teyla got shagged by a human and a wraith in close succession, and two eggs were fertilized, that couldn't happen. Of course we are forgetting that wraith do not reprooduce in the same way we do, so I think it highly unlikely we would even be genetically compatible. I wonder if wraith males even have penises... huh.gif

We learned last season that Keller had been there a long time. She was experienced enough with the sort of thing they do to be able to fill Beckett's position.

We know nothing about Wraith mating practices. Michael has the scientific ability to, as he has done, change his genetic makeup.
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JTMAG1
post Mar 5th 2008, 1:19 AM
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QUOTE(Revan @ Mar 4th 2008, 8:00 PM) *

It is still dizygotic, technically. Fraternal is a somewhat antiquated term. Go here to learn about twins.

Unless Teyla got shagged by a human and a wraith in close succession, and two eggs were fertilized, that couldn't happen. Of course we are forgetting that wraith do not reprooduce in the same way we do, so I think it highly unlikely we would even be genetically compatible. I wonder if wraith males even have penises... huh.gif

We learned last season that Keller had been there a long time. She was experienced enough with the sort of thing they do to be able to fill Beckett's position.

We know nothing about Wraith mating practices. Michael has the scientific ability to, as he has done, change his genetic makeup.

Even if Teyla had partners that were completely human, it is still likely that her children would always have Wraith DNA. As Reven pointed out, opposite sex twins are never the result of the genetic material from the ovum.

Michaels scientiic ability to change his DNA. It's been done multiple times in the Stargate Universe.
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IndyJan
post Mar 5th 2008, 2:13 AM
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QUOTE(JTMAG1 @ Mar 5th 2008, 1:19 AM) *

Even if Teyla had partners that were completely human, it is still likely that her children would always have Wraith DNA. As Reven pointed out, opposite sex twins are never the result of the genetic material from the ovum.


The baby's dna comes from the mother and the father. Since both Teyla and Kanaan have Wraith dna, the baby should be born with Wraith dna. I don't know how they would get around that, unless Michael were to do something while the baby is still inside Teyla.
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Revan
post Mar 5th 2008, 9:11 AM
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QUOTE(IndyJan @ Mar 5th 2008, 2:13 AM) *

The baby's dna comes from the mother and the father. Since both Teyla and Kanaan have Wraith dna, the baby should be born with Wraith dna. I don't know how they would get around that, unless Michael were to do something while the baby is still inside Teyla.

Michael wants the baby to be born with Wraith DNA. He wants it to be a hybrid of some sort.
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JTMAG1
post Mar 5th 2008, 10:36 AM
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QUOTE(Revan @ Mar 5th 2008, 9:11 AM) *

Michael wants the baby to be born with Wraith DNA. He wants it to be a hybrid of some sort.

Yes, I think he wants to increase the amount of wraith DNA. TO have the child born somewhat closer to what he has made himself.

Now this is starting to smell like the triangle between the Ori, Adria and Vala...
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Revan
post Mar 5th 2008, 10:57 AM
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QUOTE(JTMAG1 @ Mar 5th 2008, 10:36 AM) *

Now this is starting to smell like the triangle between the Ori, Adria and Vala...

Well I don't know about that...

The Ori and Adria were nearly one-in-the-same, and Adria was implanted, whereas this is a monster trying to mess with an already existing creature. Plus this baby probably won't grow at an abnormal rate.


EDIT: More importantly, I don't think their motivations would be the same... Any of them, I mean. They might be similar, but that can be said for any protagonist/antagonist grouping. Vala isn't Teyla... They are very dissimilar. Adria may be young, immature and full of evil knowledge, be she isn't an infant, and I don't see how Teyla's baby could be full of evil knowledge (yeah that didn't make as much sense as I wanted.) Michael and the Ori have entirely different agendas and motivations. Michael is trying to make a place for himself, whereas the Ori definitely had one... and wanted to keep it.
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post Mar 5th 2008, 4:13 PM
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QUOTE(Wisdonplusone @ Mar 5th 2008, 12:47 AM) *


Todd - I like him for an alliance - wait, hear me out - How many times have our "friends" sold us out? How many times have we been betrayed? No, I don't believe the enemy of my enemy is my friend, they are just someone else we can't trust. A betrayer of one can/will betray again. I believe we can always rely on Todd to do what is in his best interest so we know what to expect and can preempt him as we have done before. With a "friend" you never know and would trust them, possibly at the wrong time. Todd has come through for us with good intelligence so I have more faith in him then some others we have run across.

Michael could not change his genetic material (didn't know he was altered in the beginning) until he started to revert back to a wraith and Dr Beckett's drug should have stopped working. As for changing genetics by force of will - not likely

Missed where Dr. Keller has been there since day one and was promoted from within, my point was that Dr. Beckett can't return as then there would be two Chief Medical Officers.



biggrin.gif Actually I agree with you, I like Todd, he is honorable even though he is the enemy.If he sais yeah or neigh he means it & I like that. You're right he can't realy be trusted but he's usuallyl come through. In Midway when the Wraith said that he got the information from a commono friend, Todd, I actually thought that Todd was dead & was a bit dissapointed in that potential outcome. I'm happy to see that he's still very much alife.

I think that Michael decided to alter his own DNA after he got the Clone Dr. Beckett & forced him to do it for him, so that he is no longer in need to feed. You wouold think though that that would be a good thing, but of course Michael with a big chip on his shoulder doesn't use it in that way, shame.
I guess Stargate Atlantis needs bad guys but he would've made a nice good guy to.

As for Carson beeing CMO again & carrying on where the " real" Carson left off would not be sencible. Carson has a lot of adjusting to make & so does everyone around him, but he would & could still be a very valuable member both in the infermary & on missions. king.gif

I certainly would lovve to see him integrated somehow. bow.gif
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IndyJan
post Mar 5th 2008, 7:48 PM
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QUOTE(JTMAG1 @ Mar 5th 2008, 10:36 AM) *

Yes, I think he wants to increase the amount of wraith DNA. TO have the child born somewhat closer to what he has made himself.

Now this is starting to smell like the triangle between the Ori, Adria and Vala...


I know that Michael is wanting the baby to have more Wraith DNA. My comment was in reply to your comment about Teyla's baby would still have Wraith dna, even if her partner had been totally human. I was confirming that.

As far as it sounding like the Ori, Adria and Vala, this is M & M, they are not very original. wink.gif
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Invisible Painting
post Mar 5th 2008, 8:12 PM
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QUOTE(IndyJan @ Mar 6th 2008, 12:48 AM) *

I know that Michael is wanting the baby to have more Wraith DNA. My comment was in reply to your comment about Teyla's baby would still have Wraith dna, even if her partner had been totally human. I was confirming that.

As far as it sounding like the Ori, Adria and Vala, this is M & M, they are not very original. wink.gif

I don't personally see the Ori links, in both cases they wrote a pregnancy into the show though. And in both cases they wanted the birth to have more significance other then just being born. Being part of a bad guy plot isn't a bad way of doing that. The baby in my opinion shouldn't be anymore Wraith then Teyla is, I mean surely two people with 'the gift' have had a child before? I think the child will just be like Teyla is unless Michael does something to it. But I don't personally see the Ori relations.
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IndyJan
post Mar 6th 2008, 2:42 AM
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QUOTE(Invisible Painting @ Mar 5th 2008, 8:12 PM) *

I don't personally see the Ori links, in both cases they wrote a pregnancy into the show though. And in both cases they wanted the birth to have more significance other then just being born. Being part of a bad guy plot isn't a bad way of doing that. The baby in my opinion shouldn't be anymore Wraith then Teyla is, I mean surely two people with 'the gift' have had a child before? I think the child will just be like Teyla is unless Michael does something to it. But I don't personally see the Ori relations.


We don't know that the baby will only have as much Wraith DNA as Teyla does. It was my impression from Teyla that having the Wraith DNA was unusual. Her father said it was a special gift. She said that she and Kanaan had responded/communicated with each other since they were little, but no one else knew about that. So they could be setting this up that the baby will have an abundance of Wraith DNA. Will that make him a Wraith or a Wraith hybrid? I doubt it. Michael will have to have his hand in it somehow.

Edit: I forgot. If Teyla's child has an abundance of Wraith DNA will that make it harder to teach, lead or train that child? Will that child be more independent? Will that child seek out the Wraith or his connection, even if Michael has nothing to do with it? This could be very similar to Adria, where Vala had no control or say with Adria.

I'm also assuming that Teyla's son will grow in a normal fashion, not excelerated like Adria was.

This post has been edited by IndyJan: Mar 6th 2008, 2:45 AM
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JTMAG1
post Mar 6th 2008, 3:59 AM
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That wasn't trying to say that Michael is anything like the Wraith. I was just pointing out the similarity in arcs. The enemy using the body of an alien team member to have a child that they want to use for their own purposes. The Ori impregnated Vala so that they could have Adria. Michael having a vested interest in Teyla's baby.
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Invisible Painting
post Mar 6th 2008, 5:18 AM
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QUOTE(IndyJan @ Mar 6th 2008, 7:42 AM) *

Edit: I forgot. If Teyla's child has an abundance of Wraith DNA will that make it harder to teach, lead or train that child? Will that child be more independent? Will that child seek out the Wraith or his connection, even if Michael has nothing to do with it? This could be very similar to Adria, where Vala had no control or say with Adria.

I doubt it, we know that the gene has become less dominant in each subsequent generation, Teyla reported that at the time of the experiments the people would hear voices in their head all the time and went mad from it. But given she'd be raised human, taught she was a human ect I think it would just be noises in the childs head at best. This child SHOULD still be at less of a stage then the original experiments/subsequent generations were, I don't see how really the child would go seek out the Wraith when we have no evidence of any other 'gifted' children doing it. I also don't think Teyla would tell the child he has Wraith DNA until he is at least an adult, in a similar way that Teylas father didn't want her to know.
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JTMAG1
post Mar 6th 2008, 10:16 AM
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QUOTE(Invisible Painting @ Mar 6th 2008, 5:18 AM) *

I doubt it, we know that the gene has become less dominant in each subsequent generation, Teyla reported that at the time of the experiments the people would hear voices in their head all the time and went mad from it. But given she'd be raised human, taught she was a human ect I think it would just be noises in the childs head at best. This child SHOULD still be at less of a stage then the original experiments/subsequent generations were, I don't see how really the child would go seek out the Wraith when we have no evidence of any other 'gifted' children doing it. I also don't think Teyla would tell the child he has Wraith DNA until he is at least an adult, in a similar way that Teylas father didn't want her to know.

I'm sure Teyla's father didn't know she Wraith DNA. They didn't know why she had the gift, until Mckay figured it out.
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Invisible Painting
post Mar 6th 2008, 12:17 PM
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QUOTE(JTMAG1 @ Mar 6th 2008, 3:16 PM) *

I'm sure Teyla's father didn't know she Wraith DNA. They didn't know why she had the gift, until Mckay figured it out.

Teylas grandmother talked to Teyla about her father having the gift and not telling Teyla, ok maybe it wasn't the fact that he had Wraith DNA he kept secret, but the fact that the gift was there which is in essence the same thing.
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IndyJan
post Mar 6th 2008, 1:40 PM
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QUOTE(Invisible Painting @ Mar 6th 2008, 12:17 PM) *

Teylas grandmother talked to Teyla about her father having the gift and not telling Teyla, ok maybe it wasn't the fact that he had Wraith DNA he kept secret, but the fact that the gift was there which is in essence the same thing.


They may not have known it was Wraith DNA, but I agree they kept it secret. They called it a gift, because they didn't know it was caused by Wraith DNA.
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Revan
post Mar 6th 2008, 2:27 PM
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QUOTE(Invisible Painting @ Mar 6th 2008, 12:17 PM) *

Teylas grandmother talked to Teyla about her father having the gift and not telling Teyla, ok maybe it wasn't the fact that he had Wraith DNA he kept secret, but the fact that the gift was there which is in essence the same thing.

When did that happen? And when did we learn Teyla has a grandmother? huh.gif
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Invisible Painting
post Mar 6th 2008, 2:41 PM
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QUOTE(Revan @ Mar 6th 2008, 7:27 PM) *

When did that happen? And when did we learn Teyla has a grandmother? huh.gif

Ok, details may be a little off, but the person she went to in 'The Gift', it was either her Grandmother or someone she saw as her Grandma.

Actually, I checked a transcript, yeah I was really off laugh.gif The woman was Charrin anyway and her father had asked that she not know the details as to how she has the gene (I.e those that were taken returned being her lineage). But still one of her parents would have to have had the gene for Teyla to have it.
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post Mar 22nd 2008, 10:06 AM
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QUOTE(Janos @ Feb 22nd 2008, 11:33 PM) *

Well, after the plot-hole riddled last episode, this one was surprisingly not bad. As long as we don't have to see the Wraith/Eratus Bug/Humanoid thing, I think Michael is an interesting character to bring around. Has some potential. We'll see what they do with it. Ever since Mobius, I'm a little wary of two-parters. I'm going to reserve judgement until next week!

Oh, and on the preview of next week, they said "Is it really Carson or is it another Replicator?" Umm... Duh? The real Carson turned into a charred corpse. I liked Carson a lot and I'm glad to see him again, but c'mon... Is there ANY way they can bring him back WITHOUT him being a RepliCarson?

The Nielsen Ratings guys contacted me and sent me a booklet, so I made sure to mark down Atlantis tonight! Score one for SGA! w00t.gif


they could bring him back, its TV and on top of that its SCI-FI heck, they could say that the Carson that died was a clone or something, orif they really want to grab at straws, say he ascended and retook human form, anything goes.
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post Mar 22nd 2008, 3:34 PM
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How would they explain how Carson was switched with a clone?
He couldn't have ascended as his remains were sent back to Earth.
» Click to Show Spoiler «
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Invisible Painting
post Mar 22nd 2008, 3:40 PM
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QUOTE(Dafmeister @ Mar 22nd 2008, 8:34 PM) *

How would they explain how Carson was switched with a clone?
He couldn't have ascended as his remains were sent back to Earth.
» Click to Show Spoiler «


Well people thought that maybe the Carson that the team found in Misbegotten was in fact that clone, and Michael had moved him. Of course there are a few holes in that theory (I.e. to grow a full second Carson in less then a day, with no equipment) but if the writers really wanted, they could have done that biggrin.gif
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Revan
post Mar 22nd 2008, 7:55 PM
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QUOTE(Invisible Painting @ Mar 22nd 2008, 4:40 PM) *

Well people thought that maybe the Carson that the team found in Misbegotten was in fact that clone, and Michael had moved him. Of course there are a few holes in that theory (I.e. to grow a full second Carson in less then a day, with no equipment) but if the writers really wanted, they could have done that biggrin.gif

Except nobody would be able to suspend their disbelief, and there might have been an uproar about how hollow his death would feel.
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post Mar 22nd 2008, 9:22 PM
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QUOTE(Revan @ Mar 22nd 2008, 7:55 PM) *

Except nobody would be able to suspend their disbelief, and there might have been an uproar about how hollow his death would feel.


As much as I resented Carson's death, for nothing, by TPTB, I would go along with that. If you are going to kill off a favored, beloved character, make his or her death mean something. I remember posting that at the airing of Sunday. Carson's death had to mean something. There had to have been some character growth and development by those affected by his death.
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Revan
post Mar 22nd 2008, 10:21 PM
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I really can't remember any character development directly relating to Carson's death. Indirectly, there has been, in that a new character was introduced and all that came after.
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Invisible Painting
post Mar 22nd 2008, 10:54 PM
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It took until This Mortal Coil before you actually felt the impact that that had on the characters in the long run. Something needed to be said sooner or a bigger deal made of it. They should have made more references to it sooner, like the amount they talked about Weir after her dissapearance. She wasn't forgotten, she was mentioned in later episodes. The didn't do that at all with Carson, they just ignored him until This Mortal Coil, Keller was the only person to mention him until that point, and we hadn't even seen her with him but she obviously was there.

This post has been edited by Invisible Painting: Mar 22nd 2008, 10:58 PM
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