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> 410 - This Mortal Coil
Rating  4
Arcady
post Dec 7th 2007, 9:10 PM
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Season 4, Episode 10 - This Mortal Coil
Air date: December 7, 2007

When a mysterious drone crashes into the city, the Atlantis team's worst fears may be realized.

Episode Guide | Spoilers | Teaser

(This topic is for people who have seen the episode to discuss it. If you don't want to be spoiled, don't read this topic.)
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JTMAG1
post Dec 8th 2007, 2:04 AM
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That first thing that sticks in my mind is that the second half of the season starts in 3 weeks, not 6 months.

I thought this was a good episode. They completed the vision in the seer very effectively. I thought the interaction between the Rodneys was hilarious.

I hate the fact that they opened a door to unlimited clones of the Atlantis crew, as well as the replicators taking te form of whomever they please.

I think this episode it's harder to see them making the decision to meet with Weir and the clones of the others without consulting with Sam.

I thought the ep moved along very well. When they started to destroy Atlantis (4?) I looked up and nwas suprised that they were only halfway through the ep.

This post has been edited by JTMAG1: Dec 8th 2007, 2:08 AM
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Revan
post Dec 8th 2007, 2:11 AM
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Well the vision came true.

Pretty huge cliffhanger... I wonder if the fake team got killed...
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KillerMarv
post Dec 8th 2007, 5:56 AM
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Interesting to make Asurans divide as well. Although the collective sounds like "the Asuran Empire" and the Others sound like "the Rebels". And whoah, making machines try to research "soul". Even if they find out what it is and how it works, I don't think they can achieve ascension simply by simulating it. 1.gif

The two McKays were just awesome. They should make more episodes with two McKays involved. I'm sure that would keep the audience entertained.

Nice to see Weir again, it's good they haven't forgotten about her. But wait, where was Carter? Not giving her a part in the mid season finale? That was just weird, not too mention (as JTMAG1 pointed out) that there were some decision the Atlantis team made that required her around. Although, some part of me is saying that it would have been pointless to show her for a few seconds agreeing with their decision.

JTMAG1, the fact that Asurans can take the form of whomever they please was a very logical plot detail. I was wondering why they couldn't do it before. It's in their construction to be able to do that.

Guess that Atlantis has nothing to fear now that the vision proved to have no connection with it. Too bad, that would have made things more interesting.

And last, I liked the ending, with the bleeps multiplying. Thought Rodney was hilarious at that point. I was rapidly imagining the delay between the bleeps would diminish. whistling.gif

Can't wait for the second part of the season. biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by KillerMarv: Dec 8th 2007, 5:56 AM
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Remco
post Dec 8th 2007, 6:01 AM
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I liked the bleeps during the black screen at the end of the episode, followed by "oh crap" from Mckay biggrin.gif
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Revan
post Dec 8th 2007, 7:20 AM
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I expect Carter will have a fairly large part in the second part... There really wasn't much use for her in this episode, since it was mainly about the "other team."
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Sylver
post Dec 8th 2007, 10:05 AM
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I tend to agree with everything previously posted. I thought Sam in this ep would've been pointless, but maybe a mention of her promising McKay to bring back as much data as he could. Just because she's in charge now, it doesn't necessarily follow that she wouldn't be insanely curious as to what he's discovered. Which has been my main problem with her limited roll this 1/2 season.

I think the clones were done well, but wonder if all the Asurians can change who they are, or just those rebels. They didn't really go into that much detail on that, maybe next...er, month.

Did anyone catch (the real) McKay 'convincing' (the real) Shephard about his streaming program when the gate opened? Thought that was a funny continunity tip of the hat.
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Invisible Painting
post Dec 8th 2007, 10:05 AM
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QUOTE(Revan @ Dec 8th 2007, 12:20 PM) *

I expect Carter will have a fairly large part in the second part... There really wasn't much use for her in this episode, since it was mainly about the "other team."

It's not really a spoiler but...hey it is about this point:
» Click to Show Spoiler «


Overall, good episode. About 10 minutes in I was thinking it was the best episode of the season, by end it's still a good episode but maybe not the best. Having the replicators take on the form of whoever they want is logical. And can open up a lot of stories as well, security on the base is going to be harder to maintain now, they might have to do tests on everyone everytime they come back through the gate.

It was sad hearing Elizabeth is gone, when I knew she'd be back for more episodes I imagined they'd make her survive. It's a shame...

But yeah a good strong episode, with some plot twists you didn't see coming. JS played the role quite well in this episode. And it's also good to see Mckay mentioning the whole Carson thing, showed it did get to his character and did have an impact on it. Sure Sunday he was upset but after that episode it barely got a mention, it's good to see it did do something.

Good episode though, probably 9/10 maybe.
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Sibylle
post Dec 8th 2007, 10:06 AM
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QUOTE(KillerMarv @ Dec 8th 2007, 12:56 PM) *


JTMAG1, the fact that Asurans can take the form of whomever they please was a very logical plot detail. I was wondering why they couldn't do it before. It's in their construction to be able to do that.



Before Rodney altered the base code, the replicators where not allowed to do that. Now they are smile.gif

One major flaw, imho, was that the 'other team' knew where atlantis was. No one had a memory about the wereabouts. Weir knew that the city wasn't located at the original planet....
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Invisible Painting
post Dec 8th 2007, 10:14 AM
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QUOTE(Sibylle @ Dec 8th 2007, 3:06 PM) *

Before Rodney altered the base code, the replicators where not allowed to do that. Now they are smile.gif

One major flaw, imho, was that the 'other team' knew where atlantis was. No one had a memory about the wereabouts. Weir knew that the city wasn't located at the original planet....

But they may have known where to go in order to contact them, and ultimately they did. They should have made a bigger deal about them not knowing where the base was. But I still believe they didn't.
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JTMAG1
post Dec 8th 2007, 12:13 PM
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Yes, them knowing where Atlantis was would have meant that the Asurans would know where it was, but Sheppard pointed out that they could go to new Athos (not knowing that the Athosians were gone) which I thought was a good detail.

I didn't have a problem with the replicators being able to change as they please, I just don't want every other new character to be a replicator in disguise.

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KillerMarv
post Dec 8th 2007, 12:14 PM
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QUOTE(Sibylle @ Dec 8th 2007, 5:06 PM) *

Before Rodney altered the base code, the replicators where not allowed to do that. Now they are smile.gif


Yes, I knew, I saw the episode. 1.gif

QUOTE(Sibylle @ Dec 8th 2007, 5:06 PM) *

One major flaw, imho, was that the 'other team' knew where atlantis was. No one had a memory about the wereabouts. Weir knew that the city wasn't located at the original planet....


They didn't know. But they did say they would go to New Athos. They just dialed a few planets they knew had missions planned in the future, and eventually they found a member of the Atlantis expedition that could contact the city for them.
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Invisible Painting
post Dec 8th 2007, 12:21 PM
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But if the replicators scanned their minds and knew everything they knew, couldn't they just do the same thing. Find an Atlantis member who knows where Atlantis is and then scan their minds? Although I think I may be looking too much into it whistling.gif

But one other point I realised, at one point in the episode when Mckay was having a go at Zelenka I thought 'Hmm this is quite like old mckay" in the way he was doing it, and then later it turns out that this is essentially the personality from early season 3 before he had gone through a few changes. But it does show how much he has changed when looking back over it this way, I thought it was good.

And another thing which was a bit weird, when it said 'Story by: Brad wright, JM and PM' It had the word 'and' inbetween Brad Wright and JMs names, but the '&' symbol inbetween JM and PMs names. Like:

"Story by:
Brad Wright
and
Joe Mallozzi
&
Paul Millie"

That stood out and I don't know why smile.gif

This post has been edited by Invisible Painting: Dec 8th 2007, 12:26 PM
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stalker0
post Dec 8th 2007, 12:27 PM
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Overall, very good episode.

Only have 2 problems:

1) I understand from a writing standpoint that you have to get the cloned team out of the way. However, it makes no sense that the whole team had to serve as a distraction. C Shep could have flown the ship himself.

2) The emotion from weir's death felt a little light. McKay showed it well in his own way, but man couldn't we get a few tears out of someone!!
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JTMAG1
post Dec 8th 2007, 12:44 PM
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QUOTE(KillerMarv @ Dec 8th 2007, 12:14 PM) *

Yes, I knew, I saw the episode. 1.gif
They didn't know. But they did say they would go to New Athos. They just dialed a few planets they knew had missions planned in the future, and eventually they found a member of the Atlantis expedition that could contact the city for them.

I'm not sure it coulda been planets they had missions planned for in the future, when Wier was last on Atlantis, it was floating away in space running out of power. While I guess they could have resumed missions that had existed in the past, I'm sure it was a planet that had an ongoing research outpost of some sort. Do they currently have an alpha site?

And I just had a thought. No one has mentioned how this is a rehashof the ep that MS directed where the doubles of SG1 get captured by the goa'uld.

I agree Stalker, the entire time I thought that only one person would be flying the jumper. It seems that Repliwier was intent on not being accepted by the others.

This post has been edited by JTMAG1: Dec 8th 2007, 12:47 PM
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jacksworld
post Dec 8th 2007, 2:15 PM
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I thought this was a pretty good episode. I loved the two rodneys. I thought they were hilarious. Though i was kind of itching to see the two ronans fight each other. I thought that would be a bit interesting. The epsisode sort of reminded me of SG1's epsisode "tinman" i believe it was where the whole team had there concsious put into robotic bodies. But overall, it was a good epsisode and i cant wait for the next.
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Pitry
post Dec 8th 2007, 3:51 PM
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QUOTE(Invisible Painting @ Dec 8th 2007, 7:21 PM) *


"Story by:
Brad Wright
and
Joe Mallozzi
&
Paul Millie"




Hehe - it;s always that way, for 7 years now smile.gif I think it's because JM and PM are always billed together, even when only one of them ahs written the episode, that they get the "&" and BW got the "and"....

As fopr the epsidoe. Nice. Diont' like the kiling of Weir offscreen, felt it was more than pointless - and kind of "No, she's nto coming back" from the producers. Loved the two McKays, brilliant!
Also, I ghave to say I'm not surprised it's Rodney who got the "missing comrades" scene, the only character with an emotional range larger than a spoon's.

All in all, nice romp, even if it is a re- hash of Tin Man.

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JTMAG1
post Dec 8th 2007, 4:14 PM
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I agree with Pitry, I believe it's because M&M are like one entity, so they get groups in such a way.
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Rogue Ashrak
post Dec 8th 2007, 6:27 PM
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QUOTE(Invisible Painting @ Dec 9th 2007, 2:05 AM) *

Having the replicators take on the form of whoever they want is logical.

Yeah that'll be cool if they don't over use it. I had the weirdest thought though, in that scene where Lorne got shot and Keller did her shapeshifting thing I'm sure that many of us were screaming "T-1000!!!" in our heads. (I know I was). At that point I thought it would have been REALLY cool if Colonel Sumner hadn't been killed in Rising and was still part of the Atlantis crew...then we could have seen Robert Patrick subjected to those same effects again biggrin.gif . Would have completely messed with the Atlantis story had he survived of course, but it still would have been cool. Ah well there's always AU's to play with.
QUOTE(JTMAG1 @ Dec 9th 2007, 4:44 AM) *

And I just had a thought. No one has mentioned how this is a rehashof the ep that MS directed where the doubles of SG1 get captured by the goa'uld.

With shades of Out of Mind too. smile.gif I have to say, I don't really mind rehashes if they're done well enough to make them different. Which this was I think.
QUOTE(Pitry @ Dec 9th 2007, 7:51 AM) *

As fopr the epsidoe. Nice. Diont' like the kiling of Weir offscreen, felt it was more than pointless - and kind of "No, she's nto coming back" from the producers.

I wonder, did any of the duplicates survive besides Shep? They looked pretty messed up but they could have just been unconcious, and ended up regenerating off-screen. The question would be then, what did the Asurans plan to do with them? If they've just been taken prisoner then Duplicate Weir is still alive with possibility of rescue...and TPTB have the option of bringing the character back...in a sense.
After all, for all intents and purposes she IS Elizabeth Weir. Granted there will be all the identity crisis issues with her not being the original and whether she would be accepted by the Atlantis team...but all that stuff would make for good character development and storylines.

Fairly good ep (8/10), although I don't like the fact that TPTB have backed themselves into a corner again. An enemy with a massive fleet of ships, who's sole goal it is to destroy all of humanity within the Pegasus Galaxy (at least)? It means a way has to be found of stopping them QUICKLY, or else they'll be overrun within a small length of time.
It's the same thing they did with the Ori forces in S10, there was little wiggle room for story stretching alternatives, unlike the Goa'uld war where there was generally a bit more breathing room due to stuff like the Protected Planets treaty, and the Goa'uld's feudal nature.

Whatever happens, please, no deus ex machina superweapons. I think we've seen more than enough of those in SG-1 1.gif

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KillerMarv
post Dec 8th 2007, 7:14 PM
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QUOTE(Rogue Ashrak @ Dec 9th 2007, 1:27 AM) *

An enemy with a massive fleet of ships, who's sole goal it is to destroy all of humanity within the Pegasus Galaxy (at least)? It means a way has to be found of stopping them QUICKLY, or else they'll be overrun within a small length of time.
It's the same thing they did with the Ori forces in S10, there was little wiggle room for story stretching alternatives, unlike the Goa'uld war where there was generally a bit more breathing room due to stuff like the Protected Planets treaty, and the Goa'uld's feudal nature.

Whatever happens, please, no deus ex machina superweapons. I think we've seen more than enough of those in SG-1 1.gif


They've already taken the first steps towards minimizing the effects of their hunger for destroying all humanity. Having some of them turn "rebel" and need humans for their studies on ascension is sure to be explored more. This could help the writers insert more "free breathing" episodes along the way.
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Revan
post Dec 8th 2007, 9:22 PM
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The other team knew where Atlantis would have been, if they hadn't went somewhere else.

I wonder if the other team actually got killed, or if they were just captured.
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Dave312
post Dec 8th 2007, 10:29 PM
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QUOTE(stalker0 @ Dec 9th 2007, 4:27 AM) *

1) I understand from a writing standpoint that you have to get the cloned team out of the way. However, it makes no sense that the whole team had to serve as a distraction. C Shep could have flown the ship himself.

Theres always the chance that the Asurans would scan the jumper for life signs. They knew they were after at least two people so if they only found one person in the jumper they would likely think that it would be a diversion.

Overall I liked this episode. Anyone else noticed that the Asurans called those Ancient ships Aurora class? You would think that they would know their real name rather than just stealing our name for them. Its similar to how the Asurans call a Puddle Jumper a Gateship.

Loved the two Rodney's bit. I guess McKay would have to take back his statement how two McKay's are not better than one (from McKay and Mrs. Miller)

S04E18 (or something around that)
» Click to Show Spoiler «


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Invisible Painting
post Dec 8th 2007, 11:17 PM
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QUOTE(Rogue Ashrak @ Dec 8th 2007, 11:27 PM) *

If they've just been taken prisoner then Duplicate Weir is still alive with possibility of rescue...and TPTB have the option of bringing the character back...in a sense.
After all, for all intents and purposes she IS Elizabeth Weir. Granted there will be all the identity crisis issues with her not being the original and whether she would be accepted by the Atlantis team...but all that stuff would make for good character development and storylines.

Tbh if they wanted Weir to be alive with a chance of rescue, they wouldn't say she was dead....kinda defeats the point.

As for whether she is the 'real' Elizabeth or not, in my opinion a clone is just as good as the original. They are the same person, cell for cell. How are they any less? Imo she is the same as the original. But while on that point I see no reason whatsoever why that Eliz couldn't have survived that crash, Shep did why couldn't she?

QUOTE(Dave312 @ Dec 9th 2007, 3:29 AM) *

Theres always the chance that the Asurans would scan the jumper for life signs. They knew they were after at least two people so if they only found one person in the jumper they would likely think that it would be a diversion.

Overall I liked this episode. Anyone else noticed that the Asurans called those Ancient ships Aurora class? You would think that they would know their real name rather than just stealing our name for them. Its similar to how the Asurans call a Puddle Jumper a Gateship.

That's what I was thining earlier, they WOULD have scanned for lifesigns, and finding only one would have set off an alarm.

As for the Asurans calling them 'gateships', well it stands to reason that was their original name. Makes a hell of a lot more sense then 'puddlejumper' wink.gif
I've aways prefered gateship over puddlejumper though.

This post has been edited by Invisible Painting: Dec 8th 2007, 11:18 PM
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JTMAG1
post Dec 8th 2007, 11:51 PM
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QUOTE(Revan @ Dec 8th 2007, 9:22 PM) *

The other team knew where Atlantis would have been, if they hadn't went somewhere else.

I wonder if the other team actually got killed, or if they were just captured.

I think it was intentionally left open, so that they could be brought at the powers' leisure.
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