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> 403 - Reunion
Rating  4
droid327
post Oct 19th 2007, 7:20 AM
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You dont want them to wear leather, because it means you have to kill cows to make it....

OK, well there's synthetic fabrics. Woven plastics, essentially. Except plastics come from petrochemicals, which means you have to use oil and other chemicals to get them. Their synthesis creates industrial byproducts that can pollute the atmosphere and cause global warming. And creating them also requires large industrial machinery, which uses lots of power, which comes ultimately from fossil fuels or nuclear power etc...

OK, well there's lots of natural fibers you can use. Cotton, linen, hemp even, whatever... except that textile plants are notoriously land-inefficient, you need to use a lot of acres to grow a usable amount of fibers. So you need to clear out more and more land for farmspace as demand for the fibers goes up and up. Cotton etc also takes a lot of fertilizers since it tends to deplete soils very rapidly. You also have to control pests like cotton weevils, both of which means putting lots of chemicals in the ground that leak into the aquifer and pollute the water supply. And, lastly, cotton is a very labor intensive crop, meaning most 3rd world farmers couldnt afford the big machinery that Western agribusiness has at its disposal and could never compete with their prices, meaning it exacerbates the wealth gap in agriculture.

Basically, there's no such thing as a "zero impact" textile smile.gif

Of all the possible fabrics, leather is probably the "greenest" since its a byproduct of another industry (meat) anyway, and requires little worse than weak acids and bases to process.
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J&S4Ever
post Oct 19th 2007, 12:07 PM
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I enjoyed this episode much more than I thought. Ronon is good eye candy, but has not had much character development. Although this wasn't much either, it did cement his friendship with the Atlantis crew.

I liked Carter's character development. She's here without the immediate support of O'Neill and Mitchell and SG-1 in general and she's holding her own. The fact that she is an Air Force officer and has combat experience will add a new facet to the leadership character in Atlantis that was lacking with Weir.

The plot was predictable, but enjoyable nonetheless. I know that most people complain about it "being the same" story, but like we tell our students in our literature classes, most stories ARE THE SAME. Its human nature to tell the same stories over and over. They're called archetypes. Of course we would like to see something original, but after 5000 years of literature, I think most original stories have been brought out. Its the setting and characters that add a new flavor to the same old story. That's my English teacher rant...

whistling.gif

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jrv
post Oct 19th 2007, 4:56 PM
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I don't see why so many people call Teyla and Ronan useless or say that they are just "there". I'm not a huge fan of either character but I do see how they can be useful. Both characters have proven their loyalty and both have experience in battle. Obviously they aren't going to be involved in a lot of the tech on Atlantis but when it comes to going off world they seem like useful team members to me.
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Invisible Painting
post Oct 19th 2007, 5:10 PM
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QUOTE(jrv @ Oct 19th 2007, 10:56 PM) *

I don't see why so many people call Teyla and Ronan useless or say that they are just "there". I'm not a huge fan of either character but I do see how they can be useful. Both characters have proven their loyalty and both have experience in battle. Obviously they aren't going to be involved in a lot of the tech on Atlantis but when it comes to going off world they seem like useful team members to me.

Yeah, but it's more the fact that anyone could fill that role. They could get Lt col. Joe blogs in as a new member and he'd pretty much do the same job. What they do as individual characters isn't really that much which other people cannot offer. I like the Ronan character, but acknowledge he's underused. I don't really like the Teyla character as she's kind of boring. But especially Teyla nothing she does really is something that anyone else couldn't do, which is where the problems come from.

This post has been edited by Invisible Painting: Oct 19th 2007, 5:11 PM
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Jade
post Oct 22nd 2007, 7:24 AM
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Reunion, Iguess I knew they could be walking into a trap, but I thought it would be maybe one Satedan betraying the group, or they got set up by the wraith, so did not expect they all gave in. I can understand why Ronon got so mad.
Good funny moments, and good to see Teal's played into this episode.
i liked the photo of Jack, no explaination, just left everything to the fan's own imagination.
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HSV
post Oct 22nd 2007, 7:44 AM
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I loved this ep good fight scenes ,old fashon kickass blood & gore biggrin.gif
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lancelot2
post Oct 23rd 2007, 4:40 AM
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QUOTE(Invisible Painting @ Oct 19th 2007, 12:07 AM) *

Exactly, I'm designed and able to eat tomatos, but I don't. Does that mean I have to?? We live in a world where the vitamins and energy is available otherwise. I'm not a vegetarian, but I draw the line at slaughtering animals just to make us warm, but if murdering animals for meat was banned I wouldn't complain, because I know it's wrong. If I think about it for long enough I do feel bad about eating animals. Which pretty much is why I try not to.
I was actually suprised by the twist, call me someone who wasn't thinking about it too much but I was biggrin.gif Being a Film+TV student though if I think about things too much I don't enjoy them as much, so certain things like this I try to think less about. Therefore I don't call plot points as much biggrin.gif But I would have still enjoyed the episode non the less. And I hope we see that last Satedan again at some point too, as it will be a good plot point probably if they choose to.

I would complain and i'd break the law myself and have meat it's my choice to have meat and no one will ever stop me eating it. I complained in ireland when they implemented a smoking ban in pubs I had quit smoking three yrs preveously but I should still have the freedom to smoke if I wanted to. this nanny state
(or states) we seem to have at the moment really gets on my nerves. and it stops freedom to do what you want to do so basically there is no democracy anymore because 1 or 2 people can make something against the law (in ireland it was one man who made it against the law to smoke in a pub mihael martin)
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post Oct 23rd 2007, 6:47 AM
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QUOTE(lancelot2 @ Oct 23rd 2007, 4:40 AM) *

I would complain and i'd break the law myself and have meat it's my choice to have meat and no one will ever stop me eating it. I complained in ireland when they implemented a smoking ban in pubs I had quit smoking three yrs preveously but I should still have the freedom to smoke if I wanted to. this nanny state
(or states) we seem to have at the moment really gets on my nerves. and it stops freedom to do what you want to do so basically there is no democracy anymore because 1 or 2 people can make something against the law (in ireland it was one man who made it against the law to smoke in a pub mihael martin)


What the hell makes you so high and mighty that you think you or anyone else has the right to subject others to smoke which is harmful to their health? Smokers can puff themselves to death for all I care as long as you're by yourself or in the company of fellow smokers, but the no smoking laws are there to protect people, not to take away your freedom. I could go on about the perceived rights of killing animals, but my views are decidedly against general social views. I don't even understand the point you're trying to make. No one mentioned any laws against eating meat.

Democracy is an ideology at best. If you don't like who makes the rules, vote for someone else.
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Invisible Painting
post Oct 23rd 2007, 7:01 AM
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QUOTE(lancelot2 @ Oct 23rd 2007, 10:40 AM) *

I would complain and i'd break the law myself and have meat it's my choice to have meat and no one will ever stop me eating it. I complained in ireland when they implemented a smoking ban in pubs I had quit smoking three yrs preveously but I should still have the freedom to smoke if I wanted to. this nanny state
(or states) we seem to have at the moment really gets on my nerves. and it stops freedom to do what you want to do so basically there is no democracy anymore because 1 or 2 people can make something against the law (in ireland it was one man who made it against the law to smoke in a pub mihael martin)

Mag pretty much covered it but, the laws still allow you to smoke in your own home, in streets ect. The fact is that if you smoke, other people suffer too. Pubs are soo much better to go into now that the smoking ban's come in. Everytime in the past I'd go into a pub I would always come out stinking of cigarretes, it's so much better now that I can go in there and not have that. You have to think of the rights of the many though, and smoking usually impedes on other people's rights, not smoking doesn't usually especially given that the law imposed now still allows you to in your own time. When you're on your own and your own health is the only one you'll be affecting.
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Dafmeister
post Oct 23rd 2007, 3:57 PM
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This was yet another pretty poor episode. The Satedans working with the Wraith was an obvious part of the plot. TPTB gave Ronon an entire episode and did very litle with him except have him realise his friends were those who are on Atlantis. A minor detail like that could have been part of another episode.
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lancelot2
post Oct 23rd 2007, 4:49 PM
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QUOTE(magnavox @ Oct 23rd 2007, 12:47 PM) *

What the hell makes you so high and mighty that you think you or anyone else has the right to subject others to smoke which is harmful to their health? Smokers can puff themselves to death for all I care as long as you're by yourself or in the company of fellow smokers, but the no smoking laws are there to protect people, not to take away your freedom. I could go on about the perceived rights of killing animals, but my views are decidedly against general social views. I don't even understand the point you're trying to make. No one mentioned any laws against eating meat.

Democracy is an ideology at best. If you don't like who makes the rules, vote for someone else.

and if i do vote for someone else they can just change their minds on what they stand for after I've voted them in.and secondly I do think that there should be no smokinmg areas in pubs but the fact that I can't smoke at all that is what bugs me (even thogh I don't smoke anymore)also pubs are going out of buisness because of no smoking bansbecause most of their customers now drink at home where they can smoke
rather than going to the pub where they can't. I could have this discussion for hours but I can't be bothered
now as to the episode which I watched tonight all i can say is wow this was great and we finally found out that it was the wraith who shut down the asurans in regard to attacking the wraith, after the first war.
wonder if they'll manage it this time?
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Invisible Painting
post Oct 23rd 2007, 5:37 PM
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QUOTE(lancelot2 @ Oct 23rd 2007, 10:49 PM) *

and if i do vote for someone else they can just change their minds on what they stand for after I've voted them in.and secondly I do think that there should be no smokinmg areas in pubs but the fact that I can't smoke at all that is what bugs me (even thogh I don't smoke anymore)also pubs are going out of buisness because of no smoking bansbecause most of their customers now drink at home where they can smoke
rather than going to the pub where they can't. I could have this discussion for hours but I can't be bothered
now as to the episode which I watched tonight all i can say is wow this was great and we finally found out that it was the wraith who shut down the asurans in regard to attacking the wraith, after the first war.
wonder if they'll manage it this time?

No smoking areas is like trying to put out a fire by blowing on it, it doesn't really do anything. Sit in no smoking areas often the smoke does still waft over, no smoking areas most pubs only have a couple of tables in anyway. People will adjust to the smoking ban though, it's only been in effect for just over three months, but in this case it's basically one persons rights or the other, only the 'other' isn't the one endangering the others health. The simple fact as said is that it's either one persons rights or the others, a choice has to be made really.

You know I think this is the first episode discussion thread we've discussed whether the smoking ban is good or bad. biggrin.gif

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kordone
post Oct 23rd 2007, 8:35 PM
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Great episode, I think this brings up an interesting topic of the Wraith being the ones to disable the Repilcators attack code against them. That then brings up another question, was it really the Wraith that removed the deriective that stated the Replicators couldnt' attack their creators, instead of Mckay when he was fiddling with the base code in '305 - Progeny'? huh.gif
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Invisible Painting
post Oct 23rd 2007, 8:41 PM
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QUOTE(kordone @ Oct 24th 2007, 2:35 AM) *

Great episode, I think this brings up an interesting topic of the Wraith being the ones to disable the Repilcators attack code against them. That then brings up another question, was it really the Wraith that removed the deriective that stated the Replicators couldnt' attack their creators, instead of Mckay when he was fiddling with the base code in '305 - Progeny'? huh.gif

Actually....that is possible, hadn't thought of that. It was never proven that it was in fact Mckay that did it, just speculated.
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lancelot2
post Oct 24th 2007, 4:45 AM
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QUOTE(Invisible Painting @ Oct 23rd 2007, 11:37 PM) *

No smoking areas is like trying to put out a fire by blowing on it, it doesn't really do anything. Sit in no smoking areas often the smoke does still waft over, no smoking areas most pubs only have a couple of tables in anyway. People will adjust to the smoking ban though, it's only been in effect for just over three months, but in this case it's basically one persons rights or the other, only the 'other' isn't the one endangering the others health. The simple fact as said is that it's either one persons rights or the others, a choice has to be made really.

You know I think this is the first episode discussion thread we've discussed whether the smoking ban is good or bad. biggrin.gif

personally I don't see what all the fuss about second hand smoke from ciggarettes is about yes it is bad for your health but everytime a deisel lorry passes you in the street it's exaust fumes are 100 times worse
than ciggarette smoke. in a ciggarette there are something like 200 chemicals but in deisel there are over 1000 and it's not exactly like there is a choice about that second hand smoke is there.also earlier mags mentioned that no one mentioned laws about not eating meat but if you look in the post above mine by ip
he said if meat was banned he wouldn't complain which is what I was responding to so as you see someone did mention laws against meat. cool.gif
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wonderland
post Oct 24th 2007, 5:28 AM
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QUOTE(lancelot2 @ Oct 24th 2007, 5:45 AM) *

personally I don't see what all the fuss about second hand smoke from ciggarettes is about yes it is bad for your health but everytime a deisel lorry passes you in the street it's exaust fumes are 100 times worse
than ciggarette smoke. in a ciggarette there are something like 200 chemicals but in deisel there are over 1000 and it's not exactly like there is a choice about that second hand smoke is there.

That's not really a fair comparison. A truck sending exhaust into the wide open spaces or people closed up in a building, forced to breathe the second hand smoke. I'm allergic to smoke and I personally don't think it's fair to ask me to suffer because someone wants to light up. I also have allergies to perfume and it is perfectly within my rights to ask people not to spray while they are in the car with me. That has happened before and I couldn't speak for hours afterward.
Until they put smokers in an enclosed box where the smoke will not escape, I applaud the no smoking regulations.
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lancelot2
post Oct 24th 2007, 8:48 AM
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QUOTE(wonderland @ Oct 24th 2007, 11:28 AM) *

That's not really a fair comparison. A truck sending exhaust into the wide open spaces or people closed up in a building, forced to breathe the second hand smoke. I'm allergic to smoke and I personally don't think it's fair to ask me to suffer because someone wants to light up. I also have allergies to perfume and it is perfectly within my rights to ask people not to spray while they are in the car with me. That has happened before and I couldn't speak for hours afterward.
Until they put smokers in an enclosed box where the smoke will not escape, I applaud the no smoking regulations.

well I suppose you are entitled to your opinion but then again so am I so we'll have to agree to disagree
because I say if you are allergic and you know that there is smoking allowed in a certain pub then you
should not go in that pub i t's as simple as that.
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Invisible Painting
post Oct 24th 2007, 8:58 AM
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QUOTE(lancelot2 @ Oct 24th 2007, 2:48 PM) *

well I suppose you are entitled to your opinion but then again so am I so we'll have to agree to disagree
because I say if you are allergic and you know that there is smoking allowed in a certain pub then you
should not go in that pub i t's as simple as that.

But she has a right to go into a pub, pubs are for everyone, as in public house. But smoking is still bad to be around even when you are not elergic and every non smoker who doesn't want to be inflicted pretty much had to if they wanted to go to the pub.
Truck smoke, well as said it is in an open space though but it also depends on location. Some places it's busier then others (I.e London comparred to Aber for instance) but still the government are trying to take steps to reduce car polution, but it is a vital part of how the world works now. You can't just ban cars for instance, smoking is something that can be more controlled and ISN'T vital towards maintaining our society. It causes problems but bigger steps can be taken against it.
And as was said with the leather debate just because there is something worse out there doesn't justify doing something less bad if it still is bad and can be controlled.

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lancelot2
post Oct 24th 2007, 1:40 PM
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QUOTE(Invisible Painting @ Oct 24th 2007, 2:58 PM) *

But she has a right to go into a pub, pubs are for everyone, as in public house. But smoking is still bad to be around even when you are not elergic and every non smoker who doesn't want to be inflicted pretty much had to if they wanted to go to the pub.
Truck smoke, well as said it is in an open space though but it also depends on location. Some places it's busier then others (I.e London comparred to Aber for instance) but still the government are trying to take steps to reduce car polution, but it is a vital part of how the world works now. You can't just ban cars for instance, smoking is something that can be more controlled and ISN'T vital towards maintaining our society. It causes problems but bigger steps can be taken against it.
And as was said with the leather debate just because there is something worse out there doesn't justify doing something less bad if it still is bad and can be controlled.

as isaid before we'll have to agree to disagree. nothing you say will change my mind.
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Rogue Ashrak
post Oct 24th 2007, 3:49 PM
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QUOTE(lancelot2 @ Oct 25th 2007, 4:40 AM) *

as isaid before we'll have to agree to disagree. nothing you say will change my mind.


What a lovely attitude to have. "I'll do what I want when I want, and I don't care how many people I piss off in the process". And people wonder why the world is turning to sh*t.
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post Oct 24th 2007, 4:12 PM
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This was an enjoyable enough episode, but predictable. We didn't really learn anything about Ronan that we didn't already know. I thought Carter did ok as leader in this episode. And she went off-world to lead the rescue. As leader, she'll probably be more involved in the action than Weir was which is proabaly a good thing.

But the most intresting part of this episode was the Wraith-Replcator War and the fact the Wraith have fought the Replicators before. It will be intresting to see how this develops through the season. I get the feeling starting this war will come back to haunt Atlantis.

Just on the Atlantis leather uniforms, while they don't bother me much one way or another they don't really seem suitable for an off-world military unit. On SG1 all the SG teams generally wore uniforms to suit the planet they were going to. If it was forest type enviroment they'd were the green or woodland camo SG uniform. If it was a desert type enviroment they'd were the desert camo uniform and so on. But on Atlantis they don't seem to bother with any type of camo when going off-world, and instead think black leather is more practical.
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Revan
post Oct 24th 2007, 6:53 PM
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QUOTE(JC1 @ Oct 24th 2007, 5:12 PM) *

This was an enjoyable enough episode, but predictable. We didn't really learn anything about Ronan that we didn't already know. I thought Carter did ok as leader in this episode. And she went off-world to lead the rescue. As leader, she'll probably be more involved in the action than Weir was which is proabaly a good thing.

But the most intresting part of this episode was the Wraith-Replcator War and the fact the Wraith have fought the Replicators before. It will be intresting to see how this develops through the season. I get the feeling starting this war will come back to haunt Atlantis.

Just on the Atlantis leather uniforms, while they don't bother me much one way or another they don't really seem suitable for an off-world military unit. On SG1 all the SG teams generally wore uniforms to suit the planet they were going to. If it was forest type enviroment they'd were the green or woodland camo SG uniform. If it was a desert type enviroment they'd were the desert camo uniform and so on. But on Atlantis they don't seem to bother with any type of camo when going off-world, and instead think black leather is more practical.

Well I guess ti could be said Ronon is now firmly a member of the team. We know Teal'c left more than once to tend to his own personal matters... why wouldn't Ronon possibly do the same thing? Teyla never really did...

Carter is not the same as Weir. Weir was never military, she rarely became involved in violent conflict...

Sheppard is a bit of a cowboy though...
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Invisible Painting
post Oct 24th 2007, 9:09 PM
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Tbh (to be honest, for your non knowing types) we had an episode that dealt with the Ronan character. IN early SG-1 we had episodes that dealt with each of the main characters. It didn't mean they were developed. Just that they were there, they meant something. and proved why they are part of the team. Ronan (and 'my people' lady) have often not been portrayed in that way. So it's good to see an episode in which he's the main focus. Did he change, no. But at least it wasn't just another episode where he was in the background. And was good imo.

The only thing that annoyed me was when Ronan said 'You are not satedan' after they challenged to fight him he got ready as if he saw them as Satedan warriors who he's do equal battle with. He just contradicted that, after they challenged him to fight I reckon it would have been stronger had he at least put in a line to refuse them based on the fact that he didn't see them as Satedan, but he didn't. Eh well. Good episode otherwise. smile.gif
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Revan
post Oct 24th 2007, 9:37 PM
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I think, given what happened to Sateda, given they decided to fight back against the Wraith, it means something to be Satedan in Ronon's eyes.
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