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> Multiple Gate Dialing
JTMAG1
post Feb 3rd 2007, 2:11 AM
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QUOTE(mikmil2003 @ Feb 3rd 2007, 12:08 AM) *

OK. If in case of 1-to-Many Gates connections
dialing Gate RANDOMLY picks destination Gate - JTMAG1, you are right.

But what if it cannot do random pick?

unsure.gif

YOu are saying that I'm right, and I still am not sure I understand
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KillerMarv
post Feb 3rd 2007, 6:04 AM
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QUOTE(mikmil2003 @ Feb 3rd 2007, 7:08 AM) *

OK. If in case of 1-to-Many Gates connections
dialing Gate RANDOMLY picks destination Gate - JTMAG1, you are right.

But what if it cannot do random pick?

unsure.gif


You are implying that particles in a human body may not be randomly stored into the the dialing gate? I didn't understand your question, but if that is so, try to remember that the order in which particles enter the gate's buffer is a very complicated distribution function. This will always be random, no matter what. Than the buffer just divides the energy it stored equally (almost equally actually) to each of the destination gates. Since the storing was random, this process will also be random.
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mikmil2003
post Feb 4th 2007, 1:02 AM
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QUOTE(KillerMarv @ Feb 3rd 2007, 6:04 AM) *

You are implying that particles in a human body may not be randomly stored into the the dialing gate? I didn't understand your question, but if that is so, try to remember that the order in which particles enter the gate's buffer is a very complicated distribution function. This will always be random, no matter what. Than the buffer just divides the energy it stored equally (almost equally actually) to each of the destination gates. Since the storing was random, this process will also be random.



All this discussion was about what would happen with the object which coming threw the Gate which already connected to Multiple Gates.

Option 1:
Dialing Gate will randomly pick just one of the destinations Gate and send full object to this Gate. Nothing will be send to any other Gate.
One full object in - one full object out.

My question was what if this dialing Gate cannot do this random pick of one of the Gate.
Then we have 3 more options.

Option 2:
Dialing Gate sends to each destination Gate part of the object.
One full object in – nothing out because destination Gates cannot re-materialize part – they need full object to do so.


Option 3:
Dialing Gate sends to each destination Gate full object. Each destination Gate will
re-materialize full object.
One full object in - many full objects out.

Option 4:
Dialing Gate in such situation when there are many simultaneous destinations – just won’t send object to any destination Gate.
One full object into dialing Gate - one full objects out from the dialing Gate.

unsure.gif
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JTMAG1
post Feb 4th 2007, 1:20 AM
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The only thing that we know is that energy wave are distribuated evenly to each gate. Anything else is speculation. We've already talked about what we feel is likely, but no one can tell you what would definitively happen.
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mikmil2003
post Feb 4th 2007, 2:03 AM
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QUOTE(JTMAG1 @ Feb 4th 2007, 1:20 AM) *

The only thing that we know is that energy wave are distribuated evenly to each gate. Anything else is speculation. We've already talked about what we feel is likely, but no one can tell you what would definitively happen.


Agree. There is a luck of info. At this moment it is moot point. Will see if in remaining episodes will see more info about this.

unsure.gif
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KillerMarv
post Feb 4th 2007, 5:43 PM
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QUOTE(JTMAG1 @ Feb 4th 2007, 8:20 AM) *

The only thing that we know is that energy wave are distribuated evenly to each gate. Anything else is speculation. We've already talked about what we feel is likely, but no one can tell you what would definitively happen.


Before I contradict anything, I should say that I realized that energy is also stored in the buffer or somewhere for just a little time. Any energy wave has a frequency, and this frequency is composed of periods. The dialed gate must wait until a full period has passed before it sends the signal. And yes it waits, by storing the energy signature in the buffer. Because this could be very slow at high frequency signals, the gate could have a more logical mechanism. It stops the signal right at the event horizon until it completes a period, than sends it through. If the other end of the wormhole is multiple, the energy sent would be split across all the gates evenly or not, but the signal would still have the same frequency. Now:

Option 1:

If matter would be sent randomly to one of the gate, than there is no reason to why the gates wouldn't do the same for energy. Since energy is halted at the event horizon, and matter becomes energy as well there, the gate can no longer act differently with the particles there. If it would send matter to just one random gate, it should do the same with energy, and we know that this didn't happen, because we saw the weapon at Dakara work all across the galaxy.

Option 2:

If this happens to energy, it would happen to matter as well, because of what I have just said.

Option 3:

The gate cannot do this, because particles cannot multiply out of nowhere. Particles do not appear spontaneously, especially identical ones.

Option 4:

The gate never sends back through the same wormhole, because that would make a wormhole bi-directional, which is not possible. And like I said, energy is treated like that, matter must be treated the same.

There is still one question that JTMAG1 may ask now: "What about the fact that energy is the only one that can travel in both ways". The answer is quite simple. It lies in computer architecture. Consider two registers and a pipeline. Like in this simple drawing:

IPB Image

Now, the pipeline is imprinted with a one-way travel. A is the Sender, B is the Receiver. A must send information to B. If B would attempt to send information to A, there would be a conflict on the pipeline, and information may be lost. Two sets of information can never be on one pipeline. So, we have:

1. Connection established. A is the Sender, B is the Receiver. Pipeline is idle.
2. A stores information. Let's say that is matter.
3. A sends to B "Start". That is energy in the Stargate example.
4. A sends bits of information.
5. A sends "End".
6. B sends acknowledged signal (also energy).

You see, although this is a one way pipeline, B is still able to send acknowledge to A, because A must know if the information was sent, so that it can start sending more. So, if B wouldn't send any signal to A, A could start sending signal before B could use the valuable information and overwrite it.

Consider another example:

A is filled. It starts sending information to the B buffer. At the same time, someone would step through B. The buffer of B would now just get erased, or there would be a conflict. B is sent to A. A must store it, so it will also empty it's buffer. The Ancients said they can't have that, so they must have inserted a protocol to stop this from happening.

So, that is why energy is the only one that can go in both directions: it doesn't need to be stored in the buffer, and it is the only way gates know that it is safe to shut down.

So, that is all about how gates work. I hope that all is now understood. We have all the information needed to answer many questions if we think a little. Thank you for your patience on such a long post.
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Revan
post Feb 4th 2007, 5:56 PM
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What makes radio signals different?
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KillerMarv
post Feb 4th 2007, 6:14 PM
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QUOTE(Revan @ Feb 5th 2007, 12:56 AM) *

What makes radio signals different?


Read it again, Revan. I said that energy can travel both ways because it doesn't need to be stored in the buffer before being sent, thus it won't cause conflicts. 1.gif

Although, I think JTMAG1 already said that... I explained more, ha ha ha... laugh.gif

This post has been edited by KillerMarv: Feb 4th 2007, 6:22 PM
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JTMAG1
post Feb 4th 2007, 7:11 PM
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QUOTE(KillerMarv @ Feb 4th 2007, 6:14 PM) *


Read it again, Revan. I said that energy can travel both ways because it doesn't need to be stored in the buffer before being sent, thus it won't cause conflicts. 1.gif

Although, I think JTMAG1 already said that... I explained more, ha ha ha... laugh.gif


I might have said that, it sounds like me... but I can't be sure.

I think it gets confusing when you use the term energy to describe a radio signal. Someone I migh some alone and say, "Marv, if energy can travel both ways, what happens when you shoot and energy weapon at an incoming wormhole?"

That question my have no bearing because we don't know happens when matter enters an incoming wormhole. I think should be showing before the series ends.
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KillerMarv
post Feb 4th 2007, 7:21 PM
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QUOTE(JTMAG1 @ Feb 5th 2007, 2:11 AM) *

"Marv, if energy can travel both ways, what happens when you shoot and energy weapon at an incoming wormhole?"


Yes, I think I should have said energy wave, instead of just energy. A pattern that doesn't have a stable frequency will always be stored in a buffer to be sent through. Therefore, the blast will not go through.

About what happens when matter enters an incoming wormhole. What we know for sure is that the gate's buffer won't accept it.

1. I won't be stepping through the gate and come out again, because that would be against the nature of the wormhole. I would have to be stored in the buffer for that to happen.

2. I could be dematerialized by the wormhole and the particles would not be stored in the buffer, nor sent through, because no stable frequency would be detected. When the gate would shut down, the event horizon would destabilize along with me. 1.gif

3. I could just pass through the gate like a ghost. But I think we saw an episode in which someone said that passing through an incoming wormhole would kill you, so this falls.

The only # remaining is 2.
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JTMAG1
post Feb 4th 2007, 7:28 PM
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QUOTE(KillerMarv @ Feb 4th 2007, 7:21 PM) *


Yes, I think I should have said energy wave, instead of just energy. A pattern that doesn't have a stable frequency will always be stored in a buffer to be sent through. Therefore, the blast will not go through.

About what happens when matter enters an incoming wormhole. What we know for sure is that the gate's buffer won't accept it.

1. I won't be stepping through the gate and come out again, because that would be against the nature of the wormhole. I would have to be stored in the buffer for that to happen.

2. I could be dematerialized by the wormhole and the particles would not be stored in the buffer, nor sent through, because no stable frequency would be detected. When the gate would shut down, the event horizon would destabilize along with me. 1.gif

3. I could just pass through the gate like a ghost. But I think we saw an episode in which someone said that passing through an incoming wormhole would kill you, so this falls.

The only # remaining is 2.


Yeah, you're right about that, only scenario 2 is plausible given the eminment(sp?) death.
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Revan
post Feb 4th 2007, 9:24 PM
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There is an easy out:

The Ancients were highly advanced and had a lot of time to figure this out. Certain types and amounts and intensities of energy travel certain ways through the wormhole that is created. Matter must be transformed, and can only travel one way... other sorts of energy can travel both ways, etc.
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KillerMarv
post Feb 5th 2007, 3:23 AM
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QUOTE(Revan @ Feb 5th 2007, 4:24 AM) *

There is an easy out:

The Ancients were highly advanced and had a lot of time to figure this out. Certain types and amounts and intensities of energy travel certain ways through the wormhole that is created. Matter must be transformed, and can only travel one way... other sorts of energy can travel both ways, etc.


That is not an easy way out. Physics is always the easy way out. It's quite simple: Energy waves don't need to be stored in any buffer to travel, so they can travel both ways. Matter and non-wave energetic patterns need to be stored in the buffer, because they have certain properties that must remain the same, and perhaps some particles with properties that would be lost during gate travel, so they can only go from Sender to Receiver, so to not cause conflicts.

It can't get any easier than this. rolleyes.gif
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Tony23310
post Sep 24th 2011, 2:20 PM
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QUOTE(Gotanks @ Jan 21st 2007, 4:49 PM) *

I haven't posted here for a year or so.. but I just came up with an idea while rewatching some old stargate episodes.

We all know that we can dial more stargates at once on one location. But what exactly does happen in that process? Is the exact same matter just sent to all the stargates, and then they come out on that end? If so, wouldn't that like mean, if we dial to 20 stargates from Earth, we throw a ZPM through the gate. One ZPM would come out on each gate, meaning we should have 20 ZPM's?

Nice thought!!! It would be very good idea to do that in the series!
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